Lenise Ligon with Fox10 News

Lenise Ligon with Fox10 News

This week we're sitting down with Lenise Ligon. Lenise is a local TV personality, co-anchoring on Fox10 News in the evenings. Listen to this week's episode to hear her story and her unique perspective on how you can use your platform to benefit your community.

Produced by Blue Fish in Mobile, Alabama


Lenise Ligon: Hi, I'm Lenise Ligon. Good to be here. I guess most people know me from Fox 10 News.

Marcus Neto: Awesome. Welcome to the podcast, Lenise.

Lenise Ligon: Thank you.

Marcus Neto: Yeah, I know we did a latte judging competition, probably what, like five months ago, or so and had the pleasure of meeting you, and so I'm excited about having you in the hot seat today.

Lenise Ligon: I almost stopped to bring you a cup of coffee, but I didn't want to be late.

Marcus Neto: No, I appreciate that. Honestly, I think I've had my fill. Just as a side note, we had a leadership meeting this morning at Ruby Slipper, and so I am fully caffeinated, so if I'm talking really fast-

Lenise Ligon: Well, that makes one of us.

Marcus Neto: Yeah. Normally, the way that we start is we want to hear a little bit about you. Why don't you tell us the story of Lenise? Where are you from? Where'd you go to high school? Did you go to college? Did you graduate college? Because, many of our guests did not. I know you're married, but why don't you tell us about that, and just give us some of your back story.

Lenise Ligon: Okay. I'll try to keep it concise. Most people know that I love to talk, so from Detroit, Michigan, born and raised. I went to Michigan State University, go green and white. Went to Southfield Lathrup High School, but that's not going to mean much to anyone here. It was in a suburb of Detroit. My husband likes to joke with me all the time. He's like, "You're not from Detroit, you're from Southfield. It's a suburb." I'm like, "No, I'm from Detroit. Don't take that from me."

Marcus Neto: Right. It's like me saying I'm from DC, but I grew up in Northern Virginia, which most people wouldn't, but yeah.

Lenise Ligon: It's around the corner.

Marcus Neto: Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: Yeah, got into journalism school at Michigan State late. I thought that I wanted to be a psychiatrist. I studied, gosh, I studied that up into my sophomore year, and I was on a study abroad program, because I love different cultures and foreign language.

Lenise Ligon: I was living in Mexico and I was there for about six months and suddenly, one of the teachers there told me, "I don't think this is going to work out for you." She said, "You have a hard time of letting things go. Not everything is going to be gray. Sometimes you're not going to have an answer, and you're going to have to move on," but I live in that gray area. I love that. I don't like a right or wrong, I don't like a black or a white. I think that there are multiple answers and multiple scenarios to things. It was difficult for me to move beyond that, and it was also hard, because she's like, yeah, sophomore year you have all these college credits, you need to find something else to do." And, single parent household, so I didn't know what to tell my mom. I knew she was right though, in my heart I knew she was right and at the end of the day really I just wanted to help people and I was always a good listener.

Lenise Ligon: I went back to Detroit where they have this arts, beats, and eats festival and it's where they have all these different artists come out and vendors, and it's just a good time. And, there was a news anchor there by the name of Diana Lewis, and I just saw these people crowding around her, and they were talking about just how helpful she had been to them, and helping them figure things out. And I thought, wow, that's cool. She's making a difference. At the end of the day, I think that's what we all want to do, make a difference.

Lenise Ligon: And so, my mom's like, go talk to her and ask her, what's it like to be a journalist since you're trying to find a new career path? And I said, I'm not going to talk to her, she doesn't know me. She's going to think I'm some snot nosed kid. So, we left the festival and then my mother, when we got in the car, she gave me her card. She said, I talked to her, she said to call her, and you better do it. She gave me that mom look, that mom voice, that I still haven't mastered with my two children. And, I knew that I needed to give her a call and I did. And long story short, here I am.

Marcus Neto: So, I mean it's interesting. So, you live in the gray but, I mean is news gray?

Lenise Ligon: It is not. It is not.

Marcus Neto: How did you, I mean how did you reconcile that?

Lenise Ligon: I think it's only recently become that way. When I first started, there was a lot more color that was allowed in our content and in our broadcasting. But now, it's so polarized. Yeah. And I don't like using that word, but that's exactly what it is.

Marcus Neto: But the truth is, it's really, the life is in the gray.

Lenise Ligon: It is. So I find other ways to explore that, and that's almost why I'm here because I started a podcast, and the person that I interviewed said that you were the first to interview them. But, that gives me an outlet to explore more that's out there.

Marcus Neto: Yeah, yeah. As we've kind of gotten to know each other, I've recognized that that's who you are. And I just, I always thought it was kind of interesting that you ended up in journalism, and I get it, you've been doing this for a bit, and so I won't say how long.

Lenise Ligon: I will say, gosh, this year 2020, do you say twenty, twenty, or two thousand twenty?

Marcus Neto: Twenty, twenty.

Lenise Ligon: Do you say it's a new decade, or do you say it's not a new decade? Some people get really upset about that. Be careful.

Marcus Neto: I think people need to loosen up a little bit. It's a new decade, damn it.

Lenise Ligon: Yes, thank you.

Marcus Neto: High five.

Lenise Ligon: I'm like what, really? Okay.

Marcus Neto: Seriously.

Lenise Ligon: But yeah, I've been doing it for 20 years. I started in high school. No, I started in college, right after I figured out that I was going to start journalism, because I was behind the curve. Most journalists know that that's what they want to be when they're like nine.

Marcus Neto: And, they've worked on the school newspaper.

Lenise Ligon: Yes, so I had to catch up and I had to do all of that. So, my junior and senior year, there was no partying for me. There were no basketball and football games. I didn't do any of that until I graduated. I didn't have that college life until after.

Marcus Neto: Wow, yeah. No, that's cool. Well, I mean you said, you and your husband met in college. Is that?

Lenise Ligon: My husband and I met in the sixth grade.

Marcus Neto: Oh, come on.

Lenise Ligon: Yeah, I know.

Marcus Neto: Gosh, I mean, obviously, did you start dating? I mean, you didn't start dating. Please tell me you didn't start dating in sixth grade.

Lenise Ligon: We went too. Well, listen, I will tell you. No, and he always tells the story differently. He will tell you, she wouldn't give me the time of day. I had to keep asking and asking. But yes. So we went to, well, he invited me to the eighth grade dinner dance-

Marcus Neto: So you've been together for a long time.

Lenise Ligon: ... but so did two other guys. So, I kind of went with all three, but we remained friends, and in high school, he wanted to date, but I was already dating, and I wasn't really interested. It was my senior year of high school that I said, okay. So, we dated for five years, got engaged, broke off the engagement, dated other people, and got engaged again, dated for another four years. Then got married.

Marcus Neto: She's scared of commitment folks.

Lenise Ligon: Yeah. You know, it is not a secret, everyone knows that about me.

Marcus Neto: Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: I just-

Marcus Neto: It's that whole gray area thing, and marriage is-

Lenise Ligon: That's why I don't like the word news anchor, it's like you're anchored, and it's like no, I am not.

Marcus Neto: I'm a floater, so.

Lenise Ligon: Yes.

Marcus Neto: Well, go back to your first job, not first news job, not first, you know. I mean literally your first job flipping burgers, or whatever it was. Tell us what that was and were there any lessons that you still remember from that?

Lenise Ligon: I was a telemarketer for a nonprofit that helped raise money for terminally ill children. And, it was in high school, it was a co-op, because I've always been kind of aggressive. So, I finished most of my credits for high school when I was going into the 11th grade.

Marcus Neto: Wow.

Lenise Ligon: So, they need to keep me there because I couldn't go out of the school. So, they allowed me to have a job to where I was in school. I think class started at about eight o'clock but I was done by 11, and then from 11 until four, I could have a job.

Marcus Neto: And some money.

Lenise Ligon: Mm-hmm (affirmative). I was a telemarketer, and I was, then, a not nice person, but what I learned from, okay, so I'll give you a quick story. There was this one phone call that I had with this lady and before I could even get it out as she picks up the phone, hello. And I says, hello, I'm... And, she just hangs up on me. And I thought, how rude, you don't even know what I'm going to say. So, I called her back and I said, listen, I'm sure that was a mistake. This is me. This is like some, high school kid.

Marcus Neto: Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: I was, had a lot of moxie. I was like, listen lady, I'm trying to raise money here for little Johnny. I don't know what his name was. And I said, you don't even want to talk. How would you feel if it were your child? All they wanted was to have a day, a picnic with their family.

Marcus Neto: Right.

Lenise Ligon: But they need the money to get there. She ended up giving me $100. She did.

Marcus Neto: That's great.

Lenise Ligon: What I learned from that is that everyone has a story that's relatable to you. And I think that I've carried that into my career.

Marcus Neto: No, it's so true. Like some people may be familiar with a StoryBrand named, Donald Miller. I don't know if that name resonates with you at all, but Donald Miller wrote, Blue Light Jazz and a lot of people are familiar with that book. And then, he moved out of being an author and writing those types of books, and is now doing, I mean he's working in the marketing and advertising world, selling StoryBrand as a kind of a product. It's an info-product, if you will. And he teaches people, business owners, how to come up with their story, and it's become this really big thing. But the truth is, just think about that. Like everybody has a story, and businesses have a story, they have an impact, so to the effect that you can uncover that and help somebody relate to it. The more that they're going to engage with you, whether you're a business selling a product, or person trying to become friends with somebody, or somebody in the news that's trying to convey what it is that happened in a certain way, or whatever.

Marcus Neto: I mean, life is really about stories. We move from one story to the next. And I also say, just because it's fresh on my mind, I just left a conference called funnel hacking live and I thought the conference was about technology, but it wasn't, it was about mindset. The truth is, that we have our own stories about ourselves and, growth in our own lives is often about uncovering the stories that we're telling ourselves, and figuring out whether those are stories that we want to live with or not. And if they're not, then dismantling those stories and creating new ones for ourselves. And then moving into that story, whether it's currently true or not.

Lenise Ligon: So, I've been meditating a lot lately and that's one of the things that I'm trying to carry with me. The piece that we have when we're sleeping. Why can that not carry with me throughout the day? It can, but it's me telling myself that it can't. I wake up and I unpack all of these thoughts that I have that I let rest at night. You can do that. And just two days ago I posted on my Instagram feed, mindset. I posted a picture of that after I was running.

Marcus Neto: I didn't see that. So, that wasn't planned.

Lenise Ligon: It's one of the reasons, honestly it just two days ago, if you look, you'll see it. That's one of the reasons why I like to run.

Marcus Neto: Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: It forces you to focus on your mind. That mental toughness, that grit.

Marcus Neto: Yeah. Yeah. Because, it's interesting as there's quiet, things pop into your head and grabbing those things and moving them out of focus, is often what's needed. But, well, you've told us how you got started in the news, but I don't think it's any secret. I mean you have some business aspirations as well, for post news life, or as a side hustle as well.

Lenise Ligon: It's a short lived industry, and I think one that's getting shorter now. I like to think that my words matter, because really I'm the voice of the community. That's truly how I see myself. We are out, whether it's through reading, whether it's through community engagements, stories that we tell we are here to help others be informed, be empowered.

Lenise Ligon: My voice in my head is the voice of the little girl who maybe doesn't have that microphone, or who doesn't have that courage to talk.

Marcus Neto: Right.

Lenise Ligon: But more and more, I think people are only wanting to hear their side, and so it's harder to get that message out. It doesn't mean that you quit, but I realized that I might want to look into doing something else down the line. So, I had a friend talk to me about branding, and he sent me this link to some article about knowing the power of your brand. And he's like, you have all this engagement on Twitter and Instagram. You need to be using that. And I'm like, okay, I don't know how.

Marcus Neto: Yeah, I mean, I know there's definitely something there as somebody who has... I mean, you have a platform. And so, it would not be difficult for you to sway that influence in a way. I mean, I know you well enough to know you'll use that for a positive influence. But yeah, no, I mean it's just... That was a big truck going by.

Marcus Neto: We were in the process of setting up another office that we can close in, soundproof, and do all that stuff, because we recognize that as big trucks go by, it just gets a little bit ridiculous. But, do you remember the first, maybe the first big article that you did. I mean, you told the story about meeting the anchor that influenced you to go down this path. But, I can imagine even as you were going through that process of getting your degree and stuff like that, that there was a moment where you were kind of like, okay, yeah, I'm in the right place. Do you remember that moment?

Lenise Ligon: Oh boy, I, more or less, remember. So, I knew that I was in the right place because I knew the things that I wanted to change, if that makes sense. So, there are several stories that stick out to me. One of the first, and maybe it's because it was the first. My first job was in Youngstown. So, after I graduated, just really quickly, I had a hosting job in Detroit. It was an entertainment host, very light, fluffy show. But that's not what I wanted to do. So, ultimately I went to Youngstown, Ohio, and I was a general assignment reporter. But because my mother and I are extremely close, I did not want to move from Michigan to Ohio. So, I drove seven hours each way every day. Talk about a waste of your time, right? If I could just talk to that girl.

Marcus Neto: What?

Lenise Ligon: I know.

Marcus Neto: There aren't that many hours in a day. What are you doing?

Lenise Ligon: It was the silliest thing I've ever done. And so, ultimately, I did move closer, but I moved to Perrysberg, which is outside of Toledo, 45 minutes from Detroit. So, I just shaved off 45 minutes of my commute. But I could say, well, I'm in Ohio.

Marcus Neto: Wow.

Lenise Ligon: And so, I was in Youngstown then, Saginaw, then Charlotte, then here. But, while I was in Youngstown, one of the first stories that I got sent out on was a woman who had been sexually assaulted. I got to the door, knocked on the door, as I was trying to knock, it opened. I walked inside and I can see the woman just sitting on the floor of her room. Her children were crying around her. She was sobbing and rocking, and there was blood and she said in front of my babies, in front of my babies.

Lenise Ligon: So, I'm looking around, I don't see any police. What happened is our assignment editor heard the call for help on the police scanner. So, I got there before the police did. I took off my coat. I wrapped it around her. I told my photographer to get out. I waited there with her until the police got there, and I gave her my card and I said, you call me when you want to find the guys who did this to you. I get back to the newsroom, my news director, because his desk was up on the second floor. He's leaning over the balcony. What'd you get? What you get? What'd you get? And I just looked at him, and I turned my head because I'm still processing it. You know, I didn't know what to say to her. I didn't know what to do, I was in tears. A lot of people would probably think that's unprofessional. And so, he comes down-

Marcus Neto: Let's just stop and say that's the human reaction. So yeah, okay.

Lenise Ligon: So, he comes down the stairs and he's like, what did you get? And I said, I gave her my card. There weren't any police officers there. She's bloodied, she's crying, her children are there. What do? You didn't talk to her? You were the only one there, you didn't talk to her? And, it was at that moment I knew the importance of compassion.

Marcus Neto: Right.

Lenise Ligon: And, a lot of the times when you're, and I am super competitive, a lot of people will tell you that about me as well. When you want to be first, sometimes that kicks in before other things should.

Marcus Neto: Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: And, I will be the first to tell you that in this business it happens more often than it should.

Marcus Neto: Right.

Lenise Ligon: But I wanted to change that, and a week later she did give me a call, and we were about to find the guys who did that to her. So, it's stories like that that stick out more that made me realize, this is why I need to be here. I need to be that one. If I'm not going to be the majority, I'll be the minority. I'm fine with that.

Marcus Neto: Changing the conversation.

Lenise Ligon: Yeah.

Marcus Neto: No, that's amazing. Gosh, that sucks. I don't even know what to say to that. So, I'm going to move on.

Lenise Ligon: Sorry.

Marcus Neto: No, it's certainly fine.

Lenise Ligon: It was a little heavy.

Marcus Neto: I just wasn't, I'm a basket case when it comes to emotions, so you'll have to forgive me, but I can envision that, and that just drives me insane. So, now if you were talking to someone that wanted to get started in running their own business, or you can even parlay this into wanting to get started in news. What's the one bit of wisdom that you would impart to them?

Lenise Ligon: Be selective with where you spend your energy.

Marcus Neto: Focus.

Lenise Ligon: Not everyone is going to be for you, and you are not going to be for everyone, but there is one person out there for you. Find that person and focus on that.

Marcus Neto: Who is one person from the business world that motivates you? Don't say your mom or your dad, or your grandpa, or. I mean, somebody from the business world that motivates you.

Marcus Neto: So was not so easy being in that seat, is it?

Lenise Ligon: No, it's not.

Marcus Neto: She spends her life interviewing people, folks.

Lenise Ligon: I know. Oh gosh. I remember when I met Oprah, and I remember thinking, I mean I fainted. That's a story in itself. I literally fainted. I went to see her doing one of her last four tapings, and they were playing the music. They're getting you all up. Oprah's coming! And, I'm like, yeah she is. Then, she's walking down the aisle and I'm like, Oh wait, she's coming down my aisle. Oh wait, I'm on the end seat. Holy guacamole, she's going to be like next to me. Oh my God, that's Oprah. She sticks her hands out and I'm gone. I wake up. I don't even know how long time had passed. My mother's looking at me, and she says, what is the matter with you? Because I'm usually very calm, kept it together, just breathe. And I'm like, okay, all right. What's the deal? And then I realized like the interview's over. It was the cast of, Oh my gosh, it's Sophia Vergara. What is the name of that show?

Marcus Neto: I know which one you're talking about.

Lenise Ligon: That cast, they were on and they were like walking off the stage. So, I was out for quite a long time.

Marcus Neto: Wow.

Lenise Ligon: Then she's looks at me and she says, have you calmed down? I thought I was going to fall out again. I'm like, are you talking to me, like me? And she says, yeah, have you calmed down? And I said, yes, I did, my mother told me to breathe. And she says, come on up here. I was like, no she did not. So, I'm walking up there and the only thing that he helped me to keep it together as I had on my four inch heels. Normally I'm wearing heels, today I'm wearing my running shoes because was running literally to get here. So, I'm like, don't fall, don't fall, don't fall. I get up there, I sit down on her lap because that's what she told me to do. She pulls me in and I'm like, okay, we are here, hey Oprah. And, I'm like, hi. And she says, Oh my gosh, look at you, you're so gorgeous. That's a beautiful orange on you. Oh and you smell so great. And I said, I showered.

Marcus Neto: Yeah me. I put on deodorant today. Yeah. What did you say?

Lenise Ligon: I said, I showered. And she just, she passed my back. She said you did the ugly cry. And I said, did I? And she said she fell out, and she said, smile, we'll take this picture. I always admired her willingness and her desire really to give back and to constantly move her brand forward. I realized how much work that takes. And I also realized that a lot of people are doing that on smaller scales too. So, I guess the short answer to your question is, I'm still figuring that out.

Marcus Neto: Yeah, no, it's good. But I mean, I can imagine, it's a funny story, right? But, she started in the news.

Lenise Ligon: She did.

Marcus Neto: And, progressed into one of the most powerful people on the planet. So, I can imagine, I mean, she's benefited. And, let's not discount, she's a woman and she's black. And so, I can imagine there's a very significant, a powerful position that she holds.

Lenise Ligon: She gives back.

Marcus Neto: Yeah. And, just the positive influence. Like, we were talking before, you asked me why we do this, what's the purpose? And, the purpose is to be a positive voice for the business community in Mobile. Right? Just point blank. And so, yeah, I think it's important for people to realize, no matter where you are, you have the ability to be a positive force. You have the ability to be used for good and to the effect that you can recognize that and move into it, the more power you'll be given to share that voice and that good. So, are there any books, podcasts, people, or organizations that have been helpful in your journey?

Lenise Ligon: I just got finished reading Tailormade, and it's by Alex Seeley. I love that book. It's all about her journey as she was growing up. It's a Christian, it's a faith based book. I'm also just starting Love Does. I like to bring in positive energy in my life, because so much of my professional life is just not. So, those would be the two books that I'm, the one that I just finished reading and the one that I've just started, I'm also reading this book. Oh my gosh, it's called, gosh I just forgot the name of it. But it's all about the different microorganisms and tiny bugs and germs that are around us.

Marcus Neto: Oh gosh.

Lenise Ligon: I know, myself.

Marcus Neto: That's the kind to make you start itching all over.

Lenise Ligon: Yeah, most people would think that I would not want to read that, but it's fascinating to me. I've got to find, I'll send you a picture of it when I remember the name. Oh, my memory's not what it should be. In terms of podcasts really, I've just been meditating.

Marcus Neto: Sure.

Lenise Ligon: So, I use app Holy Insight.

Marcus Neto: Calm, and headspace, and stuff like that?

Lenise Ligon: Holy Insight.

Marcus Neto: Okay.

Lenise Ligon: That's the one I use. But, if I were to pull out my phone, and I don't want to do that, because it can mess up the microphones, to see my podcasts lists. You would find Stown. That was the first one that got me hooked. Did you see that one, or did you listen to that one?

Marcus Neto: No, my tendency is towards leadership, and business, and stuff like that.

Lenise Ligon: Okay. I did that one. I got into Gary V, and I was so bummed when I found out that he was here recently.

Marcus Neto: Oh, you didn't know?

Lenise Ligon: I did not know.

Marcus Neto: Okay. Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: What is that?

Marcus Neto: You need to get plugged in, I'm telling you. You know what?

Lenise Ligon: I've been here for almost 10 years and I'm still not, I'm like hidden.

Marcus Neto: I'll start sending you stuff. It's funny.

Lenise Ligon: And then, gosh, I'd have to get it out. There's the vegan podcast that I listened to, just to help with different ideas because I love to cook. And, in this one they go, Oh and the running podcasts. Usually I listened to them when I am in my car because when I'm running I like to just have a clear space. So, in looking, it's the strength running podcasts, Ted talks daily, how I built this, dr death, dirty John, up and vanished, the Brown vegan, live and die in LA, the dropout, blackout, and cereal, and live awake, live awake.

Marcus Neto: Yeah, I love that, how I built this. As a matter of fact, we've been doing this for a long time and when, how I built this came out, I was so bummed because I was like, the concept behind that podcast is very much somewhat me. It was very similar to the concept behind this, and I was like, man. But you're asking the things.

Lenise Ligon: You can still do it.

Marcus Neto: Yeah, yeah. No, I mean, because, we're engaging with the audience here in Mobile and smaller voices, then they're interviewing... The one that sticks out is the lady that started Spanx, I can't remember her name off the top of my head.

Lenise Ligon: Oh yeah. Well, the one that I liked was the guy who invented the Tofurky, that was so interesting, he lived in a tree house. He lived in a tree house till he was like 40 years old, in a tree house, in the backyard of his friend.

Marcus Neto: Okay. That's a little weird. Not, you're not going to, no judgment there, but that's a little bit weird.

Lenise Ligon: I was like, what? Who does that? I mean, but the dude now owns.

Marcus Neto: Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: Oh my gosh. He doesn't live in that tree house anymore.

Marcus Neto: That's funny. Normally I would ask what the most important thing that you learned about running a business, but I mean, you're in a position where I think you can probably still answer that. I mean, like, what's one of the most important things that you've learned about business?

Lenise Ligon: Oh gosh. It's fickle.

Marcus Neto: It is a fickle mistress.

Lenise Ligon: It's fickle, it's cyclical. Gosh, lately I've been just trying to focus on my time. My time and my energy. And, you can be consumed with what you're doing, but if you focus too heavily on that, and you don't leave any room for yourself.

Marcus Neto: Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: Well, it doesn't matter how much time you're pouring into it, it's still not going to be it's best because you're not your best through.

Marcus Neto: True. Very true.

Lenise Ligon: So, I've been trying to dial it down.

Marcus Neto: I'm going to go back to something here. People are going to completely judge me, but, for whatever reason, I don't want to say I was addicted, but man, I watched Oprah like almost every day for years. And so, I get why you fell out. I get why you ugly cried, because you know what I mean? And, the reason why I go back to that is because one of the things that she harped on, and I remember this, is that that whole idea of self care, right? The idea of, and her audience is predominantly women, or at least at the time it was, her audience was predominantly women that were stay-at-home moms. And so, the whole premise of it was that as a stay at home, she started the whole idea of stay-at-home moms need to have time to themselves. They need to be able to find a way to relax, to have an outlet that is their own, and stuff like that.

Marcus Neto: Even as a business person, I carried that with me to where I've become more aware of it recently, where if I'm feeling like I'm just not there, I need to go and find something that's going to get me there. And, it may be just going, there was a good portion of time, it was not the end of last year, but the end of the year before and into 2019, where I would just go back to my apartment and I would watch episodes of Ridiculousness. Because, the mindlessness of that, the silliness of it, was something that I craved at that point in time. Because there was just a lot of things that were adding a lot of pressure to me and I needed something that was mindless. That was funny. That was, you know. And so, it doesn't manifest itself in that way now. But, I think it changes, but that self-care is something other people don't really take seriously.

Lenise Ligon: They don't, you need to carve out time for yourself. It's very important. It's not selfish. It is necessary. And, my husband and I, we have two children. My daughter is seven, our son is 13, and it's important that they get individual time, that my husband and I get individual time. It's my birthday week.

Marcus Neto: Yay, happy birthday.

Lenise Ligon: So, we're going away for some time.

Marcus Neto: Yeah.

Lenise Ligon: And we do that. We take family trips, but then we also take husband and wife trips, and I will take my girl trips, and I will take my own trips.

Marcus Neto: Yeah, no, I mean that's extremely important. I think, a lot of couples don't realize, and I think it's something that a lot of couples get themselves into trouble when, especially when kids are introduced, because kids will consume all of your time.

Lenise Ligon: Yes.

Marcus Neto: Then, you find yourself at the end of that and it's well known. Like, you find yourself at the end of that when they go away, and you're empty nesters, and you look at each other and you're kind of like, who are you? And so, to the effect that you can find time to steal away is better.

Lenise Ligon: I'm lucky to have him. I am not an easy person to be around.

Marcus Neto: Oh jeez, come on.

Lenise Ligon: I am not. But he's known me for so long and he's like... I told a friend of mine once, I said, yeah, he's like the complete opposite of me. And he's like, oh so he's really calm, and is all patient. I'm like, what the heck does that mean? I have patients.

Marcus Neto: Well, how do you like to unwind? You've already got a mentioned.

Lenise Ligon: I journal a lot. I've been keeping a journal since I was seven, so I write a lot.

Marcus Neto: Wow.

Lenise Ligon: I have a gratitude book and I have a journal book, and I've only had it, someone read it once. I don't keep them hidden, because they're my thoughts. And that's what I'm feeling at that moment. Doesn't mean that's how I feel overall.

Marcus Neto: Right. Just a snap shot.

Lenise Ligon: And, if you're silly enough to read it, because it's sitting there, well then don't be offended by what you might see. But, that's how I unwind. I have that and running.

Marcus Neto: Yeah. There's something very powerful about physical exertion and so often times in today's day and age, we don't get that. But the body, the human body craves that physical exertion. And, especially for people that suffer with any kind of anxiety, or depression, or if you have a job that has high stress, or something like that, there's a lot of negative energy that manifests itself in your body. And if you don't get that out physically, then it just grinds you into a pulp. And so yeah, that's important. Well, tell people where they can find you, give them the socials, and what time they can tune in to see you.

Lenise Ligon: So, I'm on the Insta, snap and chat, the book of face, Twitter, LinkedIn, the YouTube, IGTV. But, generally I'm on Fox 10 news at four, five, nine, and 10 Monday through Friday. And I have a new podcast.

Marcus Neto: Yes, what's the name of the podcast?

Lenise Ligon: Living it Up with Lenise.

Marcus Neto: Very good. Awesome. Well definitely, check her out.

Lenise Ligon: Your the best.

Marcus Neto: I would imagine that's available. Oh, I appreciate that. Is that on Apple's?

Lenise Ligon: It's on Apple's, Stitcher, Spotify, Google.

Marcus Neto: Okay. So, check her out, subscribe, make sure to support her in that because podcasting is kind of a lonely thing and seeing the subscription numbers go up is definitely a positive thing. So, well, I want to thank you again for coming on the podcast. Wrap up any final thoughts or comments you'd like to share?

Lenise Ligon: Be kind to yourself and be kind to your heart. This is heart disease awareness month. I'm a strong advocate for heart disease. I've been wearing red all this month. I do that every year. I've been doing it for the last eight years. For the entire month I wear red. Please, if you don't remember anything else from this conversation, remember to take care of your heart by being kind to yourself.

Marcus Neto: It's good stuff. Lenise, I appreciate your willingness to sit with me and share your journey.

Lenise Ligon: Thank you.

Marcus Neto: It's been great talking with you.

Lenise Ligon: It was good.

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